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closeto: lampguy
Posted by Moimeme on 08 May 2008 at 15:23 GMT
Check out Dr.Bruce Perry's work- Texas, and now- Alberta.
Interesting to note that science is beginning to validate some of what has always been "known"by observation- - -
Any kind of trauma can and may affect the brain-more severe (probably) in children- they are developing -.Of course- individual differences-.Think of soldiers and what was called battle fatigue-
To: Moimeme
lampguy replied to Moimeme on 08 May 2008 at 17:03 GMT
Dr. Perry is a prolific popular evangelist, but there are no papers listed on his bio page in Alberta. For the moment I've left off trying to dig anything up.
Rather than asking me to hunt up what you hopefully know, can you cite a single study that even largely rules out a nonpsychological, nonexperiential cause of these brain abnormalities?
This political movement is very dangerous. We know that harsh experiences cause lasting psychological damage. If the people who claim they cause lasting physical damage are shown wrong, it will be taken by too many people to discredit all opposition to child abuse. That would be terrible.
Of course, psychological state must have physical form, but this particular trend, of claiming these massive physical differences, is worrisome. The press reports of Teicher's work at McLean Hospital some years ago gave rise to similar concerns.
RE: To: Moimeme
neuropsybot replied to lampguy on 17 May 2008 at 01:28 GMT
I had to retype, it timed-out on me too.
I would say the strongest physical evidence for brain changes in abuse lies within the effects of cortico-steroid increases in the brain. These can be from medical treatment or stress.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.g... Physiologic stress can be chronic lack of sleep, malnutrtition or erratic eating patterns, chronic disease and infections, many of which are components of child abuse. The point now, is to get funding to look more closely at the gene regulation of neuro-transmitter actions in stress. This study will not be the last, but breaks ground in solidifying the need for more research money. I agree the study is full of un-controlled variables. However, the question of nature vs nurture is coming to a head when we can say that nurture impacts nature and the two are not separate. I am enthused about the implications that this initial study will eventually have on laws and punishments for child abuse which is overlooked if there are no broken bones or massive bruises. Politics is what matters on this issue, and of course, we need better studies. Thanks for the fun debate.
RE: to: lampguy
GPera replied to Moimeme on 13 May 2008 at 01:02 GMT
Well, science is also negating much of what has always been "known" by observation.
For example, consider that many of the Iraqi War veterans coming home with PTSD went over with undiagnosed/untreated ADHD. That, in fact, makes them more vulnerable to developing PTSD.
Yet, the VA doesn't even acknowledge ADHD, so how can they properly treat these veterans?
It's a dangerous error to let psychologists with no knowledge of neuroscience--and perhaps a bias against it--make the decisions that drive this kind of treatment.
I would say the rates of ADHD with Vietnam era veterans is even higher. They'd have been the most likely to not be in college--and therefore more vulnerable to the draft.
Gina Pera
http://www.GinaPera.com
RE: RE: to: lampguy
neuropsybot replied to GPera on 17 May 2008 at 01:39 GMT
Gina-
It's very interesting to me that you bring up the VA. I believe this is our most promising data base for the proper study of brain changes in trauma. Because records exist for the social study of "how much" trauma was experienced, as well as the ability to get actual brain tissue samples post-portum (many die in VA facilities) as well as the ability to recruit consent for the study, this is the perfect large study population. But once again, the variables must be controlled in terms of childhood abuse and neglect, ongoing disease, and self-care. The list of variables is huge as you have pointed out when "the perception" of abuse is the dependent variable and may be largely subjective rather than objective. Many veterans however have been in mental health clinics, so this may be a factor relatively easy to control. I say Mike Meaney should infiltrate the VA, but alas he is Canadian.